Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Postby Ken Baker » Fri Sep 18, 2009 4:10 pm

Got a free BBE Sonic Stomp for doing Lunch Reporter duties at The KCC last week. Very cool of BBE & G&L - thanks!

I have it set into an effects loop with, and ahead of, my Peterson Strobostomp. Lo Contour is set to about 3.5 and Process is set to 5, which is how i had the SM set when I was using my DI100x.

Here's the oddity: Playing against music through the Cafe Walter headphone amp. Bass plugged into my ART Tube Channel preamp which feeds Walter. The stomp boxes are in an effects loop.

The L-2500 in active mode (OBP-3) sounds a touch sharp when the Sonic Stomp is IN. It's most noticeable in single coil and less so in either humbucking mode. It isn't like it's glaringly out of tune, but more of not feeling quite right. There appears to be less of this effect below C2 and above C3. If I leave everything alone and check tuning, it's spot on. If I switch the Sonic Stomp OUT, the effect disappears. If I leave the Sonic Stomp IN and set the bass passive (OBP-3 isolated out of circuit), the effect disappears. BTW - when this "out of tune" effect disappears, the Sonic Maximizer does what I expect it to do.

Sounds like an interaction between the OBP-3 and the Sonic Maximizer, huh? Yes and no.

Put away the L-2500 and get out the 55-01. Refresher: Lakland Skyline 55-01 with Nordstrand Big Splits (hum-canceling singles) and an OBP-3. This preamp is wired the same as the L-2500 except that it doesn't have passive mode. The bass sounds perfectly in tune with the Sonic Maximizer doing it's magic as expected.

How 'bout that, sports fans?

The L-2500 has a bit more of that G&L MFD "wooly" sound with the Aguilar preamp than it did with the G&L preamp. In fact, it sounds more wooly in passive mode than with the G&L circuit. So I'm thinking that the OBP-3 is accentuating the wooliness a little (or probably not filtering it out). I'm also kind of wondering if the Sonic Maximizer is keying its phase trickery on all the rich harmonics rather than the fundamental. EQ on both basses is essentially the same and nearly flat (a touch of low boost) and preamp levels (at the Tube Channel) are the same.

Or....

The stock G&L circuit has a .001mfd cap across the hot & ground. This cap has been there since the L-1000 and can be found mounted to the bass pot, though it could actually go anywhere. As I read the circuit, this should have a baseline effect (cut) on the high frequencies that the treble control just adds to. My bass doesn't have this cap and my ear tells me that this modded bass is woolier than my L-2000 ever was.

Kind of makes you think.

I'll play around with this later by dialing back the treble just a touch and see what happens.

Ken...
...at least the doctors find me fascinating...
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Ken Baker
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Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Postby Flash » Sat Sep 19, 2009 9:45 am

Ken,

If you overload a sonic maximizer or aural exciter sort of processor, it will cause the signal to go out of tune. Learned that in my days as a recording engineer.

Also, I would recommend plugging from the bass into the Sonic Stomp first and I would not recommend running it through an effects loop. Most pedals were not meant to run through an effects loop and even if they work ok through them, they are getting a different signal that way, usually stronger.
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Location: New York City

Re: Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Postby Ken Baker » Sat Sep 19, 2009 10:20 am

Flash wrote:If you overload a sonic maximizer or aural exciter sort of processor, it will cause the signal to go out of tune. Learned that in my days as a recording engineer.


Interesting! Any idea what's going on to cause this? Is it actually pulling the frequency off pitch or playing around with the phasing?

FWIW, I did back off the treble from flat (weensie bit of cut) and at appeared to reduce the effect quite a bit.

Also, I would recommend plugging from the bass into the Sonic Stomp first and I would not recommend running it through an effects loop. Most pedals were not meant to run through an effects loop and even if they work ok through them, they are getting a different signal that way, usually stronger.


That's easy enough to remedy, but it make me wonder what the purpose of the effects loop is. [smilie=coz.gif]

Thanks, Matt!

Ken...
...at least the doctors find me fascinating...
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Ken Baker
"Turn the darned thing down!!"
 
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Postby Flash » Sat Sep 19, 2009 11:18 am

Ken Baker wrote:That's easy enough to remedy, but it make me wonder what the purpose of the effects loop is. [smilie=coz.gif]


In general, the signal coming from a guitar or bass is a high impedance signal while the signal going through many (not all but many) effects loops is low impedance. In general, pedals are high impedance while rack processors are either switchable or low impedance. Effects loops are really meant for rack processors though there are pedals that will work. Plus the way pedals are designed, they are "expecting" to get the signal from the instrument before it hits an amp, not after.
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Re: Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Postby Jerry » Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:43 am

Even the rack mount BBEs don't work right in effects loops, I remember when I had a rack with a BBE and whenever it was put into a loop it would get squirrely.
Aloha, Jerry
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Location: Hawaii
Links: Main gear:Mike Lull TC5/Mike Lull PJ5/Mike Lull MV5 Maple, MV5 rosewood/ Valenti PJ5/Kala U5/ Turner RENAISSANCE 5/ Lakland 55-02 & 55-01/Fender Roscoe Beck basses. Bergantino B-amp/ Mesa800/ Tecamp Puma900, Neve DI, Carvin B2000, Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 & Streamliner900, Bergantino CN212 CN112, CN210 & AE 4/10/ Epifani UL cabs

Re: Noticed something odd. Sonic Maximizer observations.

Postby rsnell22 » Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:06 pm

Interesting. I hadn't heard of that one before.

Sold my DI-1000 after I fixed the battery holder, and also let go of my Sonic Stomp.
Both were just gathering dust.

Bought a Radial JDI. Now THAT's a DI...
rsnell22
 
Location: Western WA, USA


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